AtlusSeven

Date Posted: 12/10 2:15pm Subject: RE: Anyone find 3 fighters sufficient for front line?

Replace your Ranger with a Bard and we have the same party. Different races, but the same party. This is my 3rd (intended) complete go-through the game. Since we have very similar parties, and since IMO I have a very firm grasp of the game's mechanics, maybe I can assist you in your plight? Let's break down each class and figure out why they're not performing up to par, shall we?

--Fighter. Obviously you're not having problems with this badboy/girl. Fighters are a no-brainer anyways. Pump Strength, Dexterity, Speed, Vitality, throw a heavy suit of plate mail on his/her hide and a big ass sword or axe in his/her hand, set to berserk, and away he/she goes.

--Samurai. Ah...my favorite class. A bit tricky to use, though.

First off, forget spells....in the begining anyways. Initially, you're going to want to boost his/her combat skills. Work on those spells when he/she's become a competent fighter.

Pump all your points on level up on Speed and Dexterity. Once those hit 100 (shouldn't take too long), work on Senses and Strength. Alternatively, you might want to pump all your points into Strength and Dexterity initially if you find the Samurai's damage output/chance to hit not favorable. IMO, the Samurai holds his/ her own with the base starting Strength.

Finding the relativly easy to obtain Blood Lust sword in the Arnika Bank puts your Samurai on par with a similarly leveled Fighter. Bloodlust attacks only in Berzerk mode (2x damage) and adds +5 to your Sword Skill. Since Bloodlust is cursed, the No-Dachi is a great alternative if you want to give Bloodlust to someone else and/ or you plan on using a ranged/extended weapon as your alternative weapon.

Pickpocket (if your skill is high enough) an Enchanted Wakazashi from Antone the Rapax for his/her secondary hand.

Pump Sword, Critical Strike, and Dual Weapons on level up, puting 3 points into each skill. Once those 3 skills are maxed out, THEN start working on your Samurai's spells. Pump 3 points each into Wizardry, Fire, and Water.

In my experience and compared to a Fighter, Samurai's get more attacks per round earlier, land hits more often, and critical kill whereas a Fighter cannot. Fighters are strong as hell.....but slow slow slow. Later in the game, you'll find that Fighters tend to miss a lot in Berzerk mode, whereas your Samurai almost never misses. The occassional Lightning Strike might not make up for the reduced damage output (compared to a Fighter or Rogue), but it does come in handy nonetheless. I haven't figured out which (if any) stats control the frequency of Lightning Strike yet, though (I'm leaning toward Intelligence, Vitality, and/or Speed, but have yet to prove it). Anyone know?

Ninja--Another of my favorite classes, but probably the most difficult to use effectively.

On level ups, pump 2 points each into Speed, Dexterity, and Senses if you're using a weapon for him/her (thrown or melee). If you plan on fighting bearhanded, pump 2 points each into Strength, Speed, and Dexterity.

For your other skills, you'll want to pump 2 points into Stealth, 3 into Critical Kill, 2 into Dual Weapons, and 2 points into whatever weapon skill you plan on using. The best choices for a Ninja are "Throwing and Sling" (Ninja's get a bonus to Critical Kill when using thrown weapons and have the Auto-Penetrate innate ability), "Martial Arts" (the higher it is, the more attacks per round and more damage you can do. Strength also plays a major role in the damage output when fighting bearhanded), "Dagger" (Sai are one of the better Ninja weapons, with their extra 5% Critical Kill), or "Sword" (the Light Sword and Bushido Blade are pretty damn decent in a Ninja's hand since they both do great damage and have very good extra Critical Kill percentages). "Mace and Flail" is a good alternative as well for one reason and one reason only--Nunchaku. Decent damage, but it's 15% chance of KO is not to be overlooked. You can Dual Wield them, too.

Keep something in mind--If you plan on using your Ninja as a ranged attacker (using thrown weapons such as darts, shurikens, and throwing knives), Dual Weapons DOES play a factor if you have thrown weapons in each hand. The better your Dual Weapon skill is, the more often you'll hit and the more attacks you'll get earlier if you have a thrown weapon in each hand.

If you plan on fighting nothing but bearhanded, simply pump 3 points each into Stealth, Martial Arts, and Critical Kill. If you plan on doing that, though, you're better off with a Monk instead.

Since you only have 2 other competent frontline fighter-types, you're going to want to put your Ninja up front.

--Ranger--I can't believe you find this class useless. Rangers have consistantly proven to me their worth. Maybe you're developing him/her wrong? ::shrugs:: Anyways...

On level up, pump 3 points each into Dexterity and Senses. This will allow you to hit more often, more attacks, and score more Critical Kills. After those 2 are maxed out, pump Speed and Strength. This will allow for more attacks and swings per round and higher damage.

For your other skills, pump Bows, Scouting, and Ranged Combat. The higher your Ranged Combat skill, the more often your Ranger will score Critical Hits with a Bow, Sling (even though the in-game info doesn't state Slings, one of the developers confirmed this by taking a look at the code), or Modern Weapons.

Many of the bows you find throughout the game add an extra 1%-6% to Critical Kill, and much of the Ammo you find adds another bonus to Critical Kill, as well as causing other status ailments (blind, terror, drain Stamina, drain Spell Points, etc). Later in the game you can find a good Crossbow called Siege Arbalest. The person you buy it from also has a renewing supply of Lightning Bolts--by far THE BEST ammo money can buy. You'll be doing 30-50 damage per hit with these badboys, with a chance to Critical on each hit landed (they give an extra 8% IIRC to Critical Hit), as well as sapping enemy's spell points. You'll also find the awesome Blunderbus in the game. This gun does a lot of damage (up to about 40-50 damage per hit max) and has an extra 5% Critical Kill bonus. Ammo is scarce, so use sparingly.

And of course, the Ranger's Auto-Search is very useful, allowing you to search while running and without a chance of being suprised by the enemies.

Gageteer--This class isn't hard to use per sey. Patience is more key. Many times you'll find gadget parts in one area....and not find it's corresponding piece until much later. The pay-off is worth it, though. You can "cast" some mean spells with many of them.

On level up, pump 3 points each into Dexterity and Senses. This will allow you to hit more often with your Omnigun. Once those are maxed, work on Speed, Vitality, and Strength. Strength and Vitality so you can carry more weight (the weight of all those gadgets tends to add up quickly), Vitality so you'll have more Stamina (using Gadgets uses up Stamina) and Speed for the extra attacks and chance to hit with your Modern Weapon of choice.

For your other skills, pump up Engineering, Modern Weapon, and Lock Picking. The higher your Engineering, the more powerful your Gadgets will be.

In regards to the Gadgeteer's Omnigun--Every other level (2, 4, 6, 8, 10, 12, 14, 16, 18, 20, 22, and 24), he/she will upgrade their Omnigun. This adds bonuses to hit, initiative bonuses, damage bonuses (IIRC), and various status ailments. Also, you'll be able to use more things as ammo for it as it gets more powerful such as sling bullets, darts, throwing knives, powder shots, etc.

--Bishop. Ah....the Bishop. Rather than write up a lengthy analysis, i'll just link you to my post, in which I spotlight this class. You don't seem to be having problems with this class, so i'll just include the link if you or any others need the assistance--

http://vnboards.ign.com/message.asp?topic=19979479&replies=27

Alternatively, if you find that you would rather go with the "specialist" spellcasters, FleaBittenFox wrote up a fantasic analysis of each of the spellcasters (Mage, Priest, Alchemist, and Psionic). You can find that here--

http://vnboards.ign.com/message.asp?topic=19982795&replies=13

He and I differ in our POV's regarding the spellcasters in Wizardry 8, but I highly respect where he's coming from. Even if you don't decide to go with a specialist spellcaster, you should still read his wonderful post. It'll help with your secondary casters (Ranger, Ninja, Samurai) when you get around to building up their magic abilities.

All in all, that should about cover any problems you might be having. Some other notes of interest in case you or any other don't fully understand some of the mechanics in this game--

1)--Right click on each of your skills (Sword, Bow, Music, Pickpocketing, etc). You'll notice that it'll note "Controlling Attributes", and list things such as Strength and Dexterity for, say, Bows. Having 100 in Bows isn't the only thing that measures success with that skill. You also need competent numbers in it's controlling Atrribute. If you find that having 100 in Critical Kill isn't getting you the desired results, chances are your Senses and/or Speed are too low.

2)--Don't spread your points too thin. Wizardry 8 seems to be all about specialization. Don't pump needless skills, trying to create that "Do It All", super- duper Jack-of-All-Trades, Master of It All character. Find the Skills and Attributes that each class excels in and/or needs, and pump all your points into those skills. Right-click on your character's class and it'll list what skills are best for him/her.

3)--Perseverance and patience are key. Most character classes (the hybrid ones mostly) don't start coming into their own and kicking ass until around levels 13-16. The "vanilla" classes (rogue, fighter, mage, priest, bard) start out good, peak early, and don't develop much more beyond level 15-18. Hybrid classes start of slooooooow, but continue to develop and hold one's interest throughout much of the game (my Samurai, for instance, still had some skills to work at by the time I hit level 25). This reason alone is why many of us prefer the more advanced, hybrid classes. They don't get stale at higher levels.

4)--You can find Anhks and other rings, necklaces, weapons, armor, shields, helms, boots, and gloves in the game that boost stats by various amounts. (anhk of speed, anhk of strength, Snakeskin Boots, Gown of Devin Mail, etc). EQUIP THEM! These are great to use (in multiples in regards to the anhks, rings, and necklaces) to compensate for certain Attributes that you haven't gotten around to increasing yet. So, for example, while you're raising your Samurai's Speed and Dexterity, throw 2 Anks of Power on his ass, boosting his Strength by a whopping 20. Remember, though--Anks, etc. are by no means a substitute for increasing your stats through level-ups in the long run. This is due to the fact that once a skill reaches 100, you open up a new Personal Skill. 100 Strength, for example, opens up PowerStrike which allows you to allot points toward it. The higher it is, the harder you can hit...and the more often you'll land blows. Discover what each Personal Skill is (they're in the manual I think), and how they suppliment the areas that your character excels in.

5)--The most important piece of info one can give---HAVE FUN! Pick the classes that allow you to garner the most enjoyment possible from Wizardry 8. Don't go with the most powerful or the easiest party. Go with what feels good FOR YOU. I'm sure I didn't need to tell you specifically this, seeing as how you're no newbie to RPGs (impressive list of games, by the way ), but some people need to hear it. Rather than stress yourself over how you can garner the most damage output (psh....fighter, fighter, fighter, fighter, fighter, fighter......gee, that was hard ), pick the classes that fit your style, your personality, and/or how you envision yourself and your crew in a fantasy setting. This is a Role Playing Game after all, is it not?

I sincerely hope at least some of this information is of use to you and others (otherwise I just wasted an hour of my own time ). Good luck with whatever party you decide on using......

.....but for GOD'S SAKE, MAN! A Hobbit Ninja?!?! Wouldn't that be a sight? I guess we all know where those Critical Strike's he/she gets are hitting, eh? ;)